00:00:00:14 Junior: How would you all define emotional intelligence? Would love to see in the chat. If you had to get up on stage and give us a sing definition, what would you say it is? Go ahead and let us know. Tim, what sort of definitions do you get? Are they all the same?
00:00:17:24 Tim: No, they're all different. But I think the I think the kernel of the concept, I think people get to the kernel of the concept. We try to define it in a lot of different ways. We actually like to use a very long clinical academic definition. No, I'm kidding. But, so let's let's just talk about the kernel junior.
00:00:36:28 Tim: Right? I mean, that's what matters. What is the essence of this concept that we call emotional intelligence?
00:00:43:03 Junior: Let's put forward our lengthy clinical definition. The ability to interact effectively with other humans. Right. So you're an organizational anthropologist. You're an Oxford PhD. Don't you have something more sophisticated for me?
00:00:56:14 Tim: No I don't. Because this is the essence of it. This is the essence of the concept. There are components of emotional intelligence. JR as we try to take the construct apart and measure it. But it's all in the service of one thing and that is can we interact effectively. That's really the essence of this concept.
00:01:17:20 Junior: And it's important to get on the same page at the outset to make sure that we are aligned on what emotional intelligence actually is. It includes a whole host of the stuff that's going on in the chat. Right. We're not saying that. It's not that we're saying that the simplest way that we can describe it is as such.
00:01:35:20 Junior: The ability to interact effectively with other humans. And what we have found is that long clinical definitions are not practical.
They're not useful, especially in the world of training. Probably I don't want to put out a percentage, but a vast majority of you are in the learning and development space. Maybe you're in HR, maybe you're coach, and it's important.
00:01:56:29 Junior: The words that we use, the language we employ, that it be practical, that it be easily understood, and that it be able to scale in an organization.
00:02:05:09 Tim: To be able to scale. So we need to create a common language. When you when you try to change a culture, you will learn sooner or later that a big component of that is to create a common language. There's got to be alignment. That means shared understanding, shared commitment. And a component of that is to have a common language.
00:02:29:04 Junior: So let's talk about why. Now the landscape is very dynamic. There's a ton going on. There's a lot going on socially. There's a lot going on technically. There's a lot going on politically. All of these things are in motion technology, not least, and that's a big piece of what we're going to talk about today. The opportunity we have to integrate technology to make this process developing EQ, measuring EQ, affecting an organization's EQ at the enterprise level, how we do that through technology.
00:02:58:08 Junior: The first thing that we want to point to is that EQ complements. AI.
AI is a conversation that's happening incessantly, and every piece of everything that we do in life generally and in learning and development, if AI is not part of the conversation that you're having and learning and development, then we will get you up to speed at least a little bit as to what's happening, and you'll be able to experience what we're doing in EQ you if you hang around to the end.
00:03:26:15 Junior: So the first skill set that they tell employees to double down on in
Accenture is 2025. A genetic AI guidance is emotional intelligence, empathy, and creativity. Is that ironic to you? We're talking about something ultimately technical. Yeah, something that's on the bleeding edge. And yet emotional intelligence, empathy and creativity. Why are we being told this?
00:03:49:16 Tim: That's the that's the thesis here, junior. Is that with the evolution of AI, is there a corresponding increase in the demand for emotional intelligence? Does that make sense? If so, why? And that's what we're exploring today. We're not just saying emotional intelligence. We're saying enterprise, emotional intelligence. The emotional intelligence of the organization at large, right. The collective emotional intelligence.
00:04:16:15 Tim: And we we will answer that question affirmatively. Yes, we believe that that is appropriate, that it is it is a skill area that we need to double down on. And we're going to explain and explore why.
00:04:28:10 Junior: It's very difficult to know precisely and at what pace AI is going to go, very difficult if we say, let's not try to make that prediction, but rather step back and make some macro level inferences, we can see that your ability to create value in the marketplace, 99% of people is unlikely to be technical in the future. It's unlikely.
00:04:51:26 Junior: It's more likely that we create value through other ways interaction.
Not least. So is that something that's going to go away? No it's not.
And I think that that speaks to Accenture's work. Work is dynamic.
This is point number two. The World Economic Forum just updated the list of top ten skills. If you haven't seen the WEF report, highly recommend a quick Google and then go read that later.
00:05:17:29 Junior: 39% of the core skills employers need will change by 2030. I think relatively conservative prediction makes a lot of sense. It's hard to argue leadership and social influence and empathy and active listening are now in the top ten. They weren't before, right? Some adjacent skills were, but now we have these in the top ten of a quite comprehensive report.
00:05:43:12 Junior: If you go and dig into it. Tell me more about this.
00:05:45:27 Tim: Well junior think about it. So the leaders from all over the world get together in Davos every year. And they create this list and they rank order the top ten critical skills for the workplace. So these skills that you've just mentioned have risen in the rankings. Does that make sense in the age and in the context of AI?
00:06:04:18 Tim: I think it does. Why? Because the other skills, the technical skills as we know, will become commoditized and are becoming commoditized and fungible. Very quickly. And they're saying double down on these emotional intelligence related skills because they will never be commoditized. Why? Because collaboration, creativity and coordinated action are are uniquely human things that we have to do to create value.
00:06:35:27 Tim: I think that's why.
00:06:36:29 Junior: Let's go to the third of three.
00:06:40:20 Junior: AI rollouts or stalling on the people side, so many of your organizations are probably in the midst of a technological transformation, the integration of AI. But what's happening? 92% of firms says McKinsey are investing in AI, yet only 1% say they're mature. The biggest barrier is leadership's ability to align teams and build trust. So you just mentioned coordinated effort.
00:07:06:00 Junior: Yes. That's what we do as organizations. We coordinate effort to a cause. Yet if we don't have the soft operating system to do that through emotional intelligence, it doesn't matter the technical capabilities we have, right, nor the tools we have access to. So it must be that we continue to develop the leadership that employs the tools to be able to coordinate, to achieve the objective.
00:07:28:03 Tim: Junior, let's just go back to the research that says what? What creates a high performing team? Is it putting together a bunch of brilliant people? So if you put together ten brilliant people, that's a high performing team, isn't it? Of course. And the answer is no.
It's not. So what's missing is that social lubricant. It's that emotional intelligence that that allows people to come together and to create coordinated action, to create value in a way that they could not otherwise.
00:08:03:20 Junior: I'd love to ask the chat, everyone listening if we're off base here.
Have you ever been a part of a team or observed a team that was highly skilled technically, but could not achieve success because of deficiency interpersonally? Have you ever seen that a group of ten geniuses who can't manage themselves out of a paper bag?
00:08:24:05 Tim: That's right. It's difficult. It's very difficult and it's very common.
00:08:27:26 Junior: Yes, yes, yes. Jets. Yes, absolutely. So this isn't news to you.
00:08:34:00 - 00:08:34:14
Tim Yeah.
00:08:34:17 Junior: Okay. Let's get into the next piece, which is what we call the intent gap. So historically, there's been a pretty much a consensus view that came through in a lot of the definitions that we asked for about what EQ is. Many people have put forward that emotional intelligence. Is this the intersection of perception and behavior or those things independently and together perceptions and behavior.
00:09:05:10 Junior: This is an interesting thing because that idea, that assumption, powers of the vast majority of the assessments and training that happen in this space today.
00:09:15:28 Tim: So, junior, we cannot overstate what you just said. From the time that
Peter Salovey and Jack Mayer published the first academic article on emotional intelligence in 1990, that conceptualization of emotional intelligence based on perception and management, those two, those two domains as power, the entire emotional intelligence industry or all of these years. And we've accomplished a lot. But there's something conspicuously missing in the way that we conceived of emotional intelligence from the beginning, something that's been absent and has really impaired our ability to measure, and then subsequently to be able to put an intervention together and get better.
00:10:07:17 Tim: Yeah.
00:10:08:24 Junior: I'm going to ask the chat a question. My question is this what precedes behavior? So if we look at this and we say okay perceptions precede behavior. Is that true? Yes it's true.
00:10:23:00 Tim: Part of the equation.
00:10:24:01 Junior: Is it complete? That's the question that I would pose to you. What else precedes behavior? Okay. Thought bias intention. Intent.
Experiences a need. Emotions values. Mindset. Past experience a lot of these things are true. Yeah we're fishing and the some of you got what we're fishing for. Junior.
00:10:45:23 Tim: Let me just let me just say this is where as people are, weighing in, what we always say is that behavior is symptomatic. Behavior comes last. And so your question is what precedes it besides perceptions, right. Besides awareness, this is the question. This is the this is the question that we've been asking for 35 years that needs to be answered.
00:11:16:12 Junior: Here's our answer. Perception plus motivation and belief equals behavior. And we can role motivation and belief under the umbrella of intent. If we don't look at intent, well let's not even go that far. Let's just ask the question does intent affect behavior? And that's a question that I would love to pose to the audience as well. Does intent affect behavior?
00:11:41:15 Junior: And my follow up question to that would be how much is it a little bit or is it a lot?
00:11:48:09 Tim: And it's not just that junior. So then you subdivide intent. Right. Intent regarding yourself. Intent regarding others.
00:11:57:23 Junior: Have you ever engaged with someone who had ill intent and then had the most amazing behavior that you've ever seen?
00:12:06:23 Tim: No, it doesn't work. That way.
00:12:08:00 Junior: It doesn't work that way. Have you also seen someone with really, really positive intent?
00:12:15:18 Junior: Come up so so so short sometimes on the skill side. But intent is an essential piece in the progression of behavior.
00:12:25:00 Tim: That's exactly right.
00:12:26:04 Junior: If we are saying that intent affects behavior and it affects behavior, not a little, but a lot, but we don't measure it when we're measuring emotional intelligence.
00:12:37:21 Tim: We have a problem.
00:12:38:11 Junior: We have an issue. So that's one of the first things that will point out is that intent is conspicuously absent in the emotional intelligence literature, in emotional intelligence assessments, training. We're missing a huge piece of the mark. We are we've seen this historically with what we'll call the dark side of IQ. We're not the first people to point this out.
00:13:00:23 Junior: This has been a critique for a long time. You could have someone who highly perceptive, highly competent in managing their behavior. And yet manipulate.
00:13:14:04 Tim: JR, even charismatic, sure. Magnetic, right? Interpersonally, incredibly skilled. But they lack.
00:13:24:16 Junior: Intent. But they lack intent. And so if they miss that intent piece, are they highly emotionally intelligent? If you have an assessment that measures only perception and behavior, the answer would be yes. Yes, even if that assessments multi rater because we're not asking to the heart of the question. Right. What is this person's intent. If we don't look there it's not going to show up in measurement and thus can't be affected by behavior.
00:13:52:06 Junior: And so there are organizations out there that are making important decisions based on the assessment and based on the format of that, that perspective of emotional intelligence. And they're missing a huge piece. And so that's what we call the dark side of EQ when you employ that to manipulate other people. And you can do that relatively effectively. Humans can smell out intent.
00:14:15:08 Junior: We know what's happening. But if you look from the outside in, looking
through the wrong lens, you're going to arrive at the wrong conclusion. So let's get into how we solve for this. This is the model that powers the assessment and training that leader factor does in emotional intelligence. We call it the six domains of emotional intelligence. We look at perception and awareness.
00:14:38:23 Junior: We look at management. But we solve for intent by including what we call the regard competencies. Tell me a little bit more about that, junior.
00:14:46:18 Tim: The regard competencies include both self-regard and social regard.
And by the way, that's true of all of the competencies. There has to be a symmetry between what goes on inside the person and what goes on outside the person. So for every every competency, there's a corresponding competency, right? So there are companionships, there's self-awareness, there's social awareness, there's self-management and they're social management.
00:15:14:18 Tim: What we're saying is that to complete the conceptual framework, you have to bring in the regard competencies, self-regard. What do you think and believe? How do you value and esteem yourself. And then social regard. What do you think of others? How do you value and esteem others? Those have to be brought into the framework in order to get a truly accurate measurement of emotional intelligence.
00:15:45:24 Junior: And so we would assert, if you're in learning and development, you're trying to solve for this at the level of a big organization. You must look at intent. You're trying to figure out, does this person have ill intent? Do they have positive intent? Do they believe that humans are valuable inherently? If they do, if that affects their motivation, their intent that affects their behavior?
00:16:08:01 Junior: If the person is looking to orient the situation exclusively for their own benefit, right. We have a problem. We want to be able to sniff that. And what.
00:16:18:04 Tim: Happens? Junior is the behaviorally, the behavioral expression of that. If you if you see other humans as an end and never a means that's going to show up in your behavior all of the time, right? You're going to accord them the inherent value and dignity that they really have. That's always going to be expressed behaviorally.
00:16:40:06 Junior: Yeah. Let's move on to the third of the six agenda items blind spots and multi rater. Now there's some data that lives in this piece of the conversation that you may not have seen before that I think will be very compelling. And we've been doing assessments for some time. We've created and deployed a lot of assessments to tens and tens of thousands of people, and we've learned a few things, and we want to share a little bit of that with you.
00:17:12:01 Junior: There's something here that I want to dwell on for just a second. And it's this sentence the moment your perceptions and beliefs leave your body as behavior, they become other people's data. I've been thinking about this for a long time in preparation for this conversation and on the product development side, because there are some serious implications as to how we approach this whole problem.
00:17:34:11 Junior: But think about that for a moment. Is that true? Is it not true? Is your perception of your behavior reality, or is other people's perception of your behavior reality? They're very, very interesting questions. And it's that perception that determines trust, just that perception that determines the collaboration, the credibility, that perception is a very, very important thing. And so imagine you're taking in information.
00:18:10:26 Junior: There are emotions going on. And then that manifests in some sort of behavior that's affected by the three things we talked about what you know, what you believe and that translating into what you do. So as soon as I do something that's data for you, as soon as you do or say anything, that's data for me that I then use to make judgments and inferences about who you are, what you're going to do next, how I should engage with you and you no longer have control over that data as soon as it's expressed itself in behavior.
00:18:47:03 Tim: So once it's.
00:18:47:23 - 00:18:48:04
Junior Down to.
00:18:48:04 Tim: Ethereal, no, no, it's once it leaves you. It's my data. Yeah. Once you go public with a behavioral expression of your emotional intelligence, which is the last step, then it's data for all of us. And we form our judgments. We come to conclusions, we draw inferences based on that. But it's after it leaves you.
00:19:12:12 Junior: So I want to ask a question. So respond with a number in the chat. How confident are you that your self awareness, your self perception matches others perception of you?
00:19:25:10 Tim: What skill are you giving?
00:19:27:22 Junior: And you could detach that from your self and you could say, how confident are you that others perceptions of themselves match what other people think of them? Yeah. So just to detach a little bit.
00:19:39:00 Tim: Yeah, maybe in general.
00:19:41:00 Junior: Okay. 253 2 to 3. So a.
00:19:45:29 Tim: Pretty general we're less.
00:19:46:29 Junior: Than 100% confident that how we perceive ourselves is how others perceive us. Now let me talk a little bit about the irony.
00:19:57:19 Junior: If you look at all emotional intelligence assessment today, how much of it is based on self respondent data? 95%.
00:20:10:25 Tim: It's 90 plus.
00:20:11:27 Junior: It's it's 90 plus. Yeah.
00:20:14:16 Tim: They're self report self assessment.
00:20:17:22 Junior: So just theoretically we've run into a little bit of an issue. We're saying we're not highly confident that our perception of ourselves matches others. Yet we're going to take our perception of ourselves as the primary data source for behavior change. That's nonsensical, especially if we're saying 1 or 2 out of five, we are not confident at all that our perception of ourselves matches other people.
00:20:46:24 Junior: If we made the argument that the second behavior leaves my body, it becomes your data, and I'm not considering it in my behavior change, it's problematic. Now let's get to the empirical evidence, because this is where we can back up a little bit of what might sound ethereal.
00:21:04:24 Tim: This is the good stuff.
00:21:06:07 Junior: Fortune 500 Leadership Studies. This is a meta analysis. Self other rating gaps average 21%.
00:21:14:04 Tim: That's a big gap. It's a.
00:21:15:23 - 00:21:16:19
Junior Sizable gap.
00:21:16:19 - 00:21:17:03
Tim Big gap.
00:21:17:09 Junior: It's enough to not be the same. Here's a very interesting one. So in multi rater concerning IQ and this is a prevalent assessment Daniel
Bowman's 360 instrument S.I. 2.0. There are very low correlation between how leaders rate themselves and how others rate them. Look at these are values 14 and 43 2 to 18%. Shared variance 2 to 18% shared variance.
00:21:44:20 Junior: What that means is that my self data, when I rate myself.
00:21:50:23 Tim: Yeah, those.
00:21:51:18 Junior: Numbers are not predictive of how you are going to rate me, right. Or at least there. There's very low predictability.
00:21:58:21 Tim: For all of you who understand correlation coefficients and statistics.
These are very, very low. So we have a huge gap between self-report data and then third party data. That's the issue. And as junior said, if you're using that as the basis for evaluation, action planning, personal development, goal setting, we have a problem.
00:22:24:06 Junior: The higher you climb, the more blind you become. This data.
00:22:28:21 - 00:22:28:26
Tim That's.
00:22:28:26 Junior: Dangerous data is really interesting. So self supervisor agreement sitting at a modest P 35 and the gap grows as we move up the hierarchy. What does that mean. Means that with multi rater feedback we have self respondent data. And we have external raters that rate the target. As we move up the hierarchy, the distance between those two sets of data grows.
00:22:56:00 Junior: There's more dissonance. As we move up the hierarchy, we become more blind as we ascend the organizational hierarchy right to how other people perceive us versus what we think about ourselves.
00:23:07:00 Tim: Is that surprising?
00:23:09:01 Junior: I don't know, is it? I don't think that it will be surprising to people. Would love to hear what you say.
00:23:13:07 Tim: There's more insulation right? We, as we always say, when you move into a managerial role, two things happen to your feedback. One, you get, you get less of it. Two, the quality goes down, but it's being filtered. And given that asymmetrical relationship, people are, they're concerned about giving it in the first place. And that which they do give is often very scrubbed and very sanitized.
00:23:45:13 Tim: So there you go.
00:23:46:15 Junior: Agreed. Here's the positive tilt to multi rater data. Multi rater data plus action planning results in 2 to 3 times more measurable behavioral change. That's amazing.
00:24:03:11 Tim: It's incredible.
00:24:04:05 Junior: So let me double click on this for just a second. If we have self respondent data let's say that we get behavior change and who knows what the scale is. But it's ten right. We get ten points of behavior change. If we sit down and we say okay, how am I doing in emotional intelligence I take a self assessment.
00:24:21:09 Junior: I think about my behavior, I think about the gaps, and I go and try to change and become better. If I include you and a whole group of other people and I and list your help and I say, hey, I would really like to know what you think about me. Maybe I really don't even want to know, but I should do it and I do it.
00:24:42:19 Junior: Then that will result in 20 or 30 points of behavior change, and that may not be surprising to some. And traditionally, enlisting the help of others has been costly in time. I mean, logistically very heavy.
00:24:59:16 Tim: Oh, tuner.
00:25:00:27 Junior: And monetarily very expensive, which we'll get into. Yeah. Which leads us into the next piece of the conversation. But what we want you to take away from this piece of the conversation is that multi rater feedback is very important. We may go so far as to say that it's ultimately important that it's much better, ultimately better to have multi rater feedback than to rely exclusively on self respondent data.
00:25:28:29 Junior: Historically you would have said well we don't have the opportunity to do that because it's logistically complicated and it's very expensive.
Enter the next slide which is where we're going to talk about I is coach. I as coach is an interesting topic. AI is allowing us to do things that we never could have dreamed possible. And the application of AI is very interesting when it comes to leadership development.
00:25:56:21 Junior: When it comes to talent development generally and how we can help other people become better leaders, that's what Leader Factor is all about. That's what we partner with organizations to do, right? We license our material, our assessments, our software, our training to help others, help organizations become better. So we've run into this historically where there's only so many coaches in an organization.
00:26:20:24 Junior: We've done debrief rounds of three 60s that have been in the hundreds and hundreds. What do you do? You have an absolute team, a huge team of coaches that have to go and do reality.
00:26:34:00 Tim: As junior. You can't you can't cover the bases. And so what happens is you don't you don't have enough coaches to go around. And so you have very limited coverage.
00:26:46:00 Junior: So we're going to call this AI powered debriefing. Human and machine is the new baseline. Why 75% of knowledge workers already use generative AI on the job. What is AI good at instant pattern detection? What does a coach have to be good at in order to accurately and effectively debrief and assessment? Pattern detection? The volume and velocity of feedback exceed human bandwidth.
00:27:10:28 Junior: So let's say that you represent an organization with 20,000 employees.
How do you assimilate all of that data and categorize it and give feedback at the level of the individual? With a leadership cohort of a thousand people, okay, how do you do that? It becomes near impossible. And so what's happened historically is that we concentrate our efforts at the point of highest leverage, which in the perception of most organizations, and I won't say that it's wrong, is at the highest levels of leadership or.
00:27:44:15 Tim: A high potential cohort program. Right. That becomes very exclusive.
And it's and it could be a wonderful experience. But but what about everybody else? Yeah.
00:27:54:13 Junior: The fact is that it's been concentrated.
00:27:56:15 - 00:27:56:28
Tim Yes.
00:27:56:28 Junior: And what AI is allowing us to do is democratize that. So what's the next one? Bias mitigation and intent calibration. Many of you have probably worked with a coach or an organization partnered in some way. Maybe it's been in-house with a resource that had some bias and whose intent was not calibrated the way that we would hope. And it could be that that coach just was hungry and had a bad day and was not in it.
00:28:29:15 Junior: The next one cost reduction unlocks democratization. This is an important point. AI enables scale in a way that hasn't been possible historically, and I'm not going to say that it's apples to apples. For better and for worse. I can do some very unique things if it's enabled by humans that have good intent, who have insight into the way that these things should be applied, then a whole bunch of really cool things can start to happen.
00:29:00:22 Junior: Aggregated insight for HR and laddie. If you've ever done. If you're trying to do enterprise emotional intelligence, how easy is it to it to aggregate the insight that you're getting from the point? Moments of debrief from coaches. You can't aggregate data. Yeah. It's impossible. How do you assimilate all of that and make any sense of it? You can't do it.
00:29:24:04 Junior: So that's something that a human simply can't do. What's the next one?
Cut debrief cost by 90%. Historically, what would you pay for a debrief $2,500, $3,500 for 60 minutes with a coach to debrief some 360 results. And most of the time, you're not going to pay anything to debrief a self-assessment because there's not going to be a debrief.
00:29:46:09 Junior: So if you're paying 25 to $3500 a pop to debrief an assessment for 60 minutes with a coach who's never seen you before, who will never see you again, and who just leaves you with some bit of a next step. How do we scale that? How do we scale it? You do that for 100 leaders. Your quarter million dollars easy.
00:30:07:02 Junior: We've done that. We've partnered with organizations figuring out how
to do that. We've trained cohorts of people to to debrief. You need an approximate army to tackle some of the organizations that we work with. They're huge. They're multinational. How am I going to have, a team that's that understands the cultural nuance, that understands the localization, that understands all the things that have to be true in order to be factored in.
00:30:34:01 Tim: You're so you're going to get local variance.
00:30:36:11 Junior: I feel like I'm beating a dead horse, but this is where we end up. I finally makes enterprise EQ measurable, coachable, and affordable at scale. What do you think? Well, you've been in this for a long time. Like what's I doing here?
00:30:51:02 Tim: I as you say, it's not only it's democratizing it, it's making it affordable. I want to go back, junior. And I just want to talk about debriefing for a minute. When you debrief someone that is using a self-report instrument, right. It's a self-assessment. You get together and you look at their data and and they say, this is my data, and we go through it.
00:31:16:15 Tim: When you do a multi rater feedback debrief, it's a different experience because the person has to go through a reconciliation, an emotional and a psychological process to reconcile themselves with the data and to accept that data. And sometimes often it's jarring, it's disruptive, but that that has to take place so that they can accept their baseline and then build an action plan that is based on the baseline and says, okay, we're going to get better from here.
00:31:54:25 Tim: That doesn't even happen with a self assessment. Furthermore, think of how high friction and experience it is to to do this today and in the past. Needing a coach, needing an administrator to set it up. I think about all of the and the and the costs associated with it. This is what it's been like. We are taking away all of those barriers to entry, all of that high friction that has been there traditionally for years and years and years.
00:32:25:29 Tim: And then we're adding I to do the analytics and to give us some uniformity, because the local variance associated with a coach here and a coach there and a coach here is incredible. We have to eliminate that.
00:32:40:19 Junior: It's big. So let's get into the evaluation criteria. We said at the outset that this conversation is about enterprise emotional intelligence. So if we're evaluating a process, if we're evaluating an implementation, if we're evaluating a tool, there are a few filters that we feel like you should look through, which have been the agenda items from this webinar. Number one, do we have a practical definition.
00:33:09:19 Junior: We have to start there. If you don't have a practical definition, it won't scale. And we can tell you this from years of experience that you need scalable language. It needs to be able to be translated. It needs to be able to be passed on through telephone. So true, all of these things. I mean, if you have an organization with ten languages and you have a long clinical definition, good luck.
00:33:30:09 - 00:33:30:29
Tim Yeah.
00:33:31:02 Junior: So if the answer is no, we do not have a practical definition. The result try again. If it's yes we move to the next node in the decision making tree. Does our framework include intent and motivation? Does it measure.
00:33:47:02 Tim: It? Does it measure.
00:33:48:02 Junior: It. No. Try again. Right okay. We make it pass there. Yes we do. Does it include multi rater. We've shown that self respondent data is not as reliable. We've shown the gaps. It's empirically proven. And we've also said that if you have that available to you it seems to be the no brainer option. Historically it's been very expensive and difficult to do which I understand we've been in this month.
00:34:12:24 Tim: Yeah, we've been there.
00:34:13:24 Junior: And we're so grateful for the opportunity that we have today with the technology that we have. Does it include multi rater? Yes. Does it incorporate AI? If the answer is no there and you have multi rater feedback enabled then you have a big problem on your hands. And it's solvable with a lot of humans and a lot of capital.
00:34:33:02 Junior: So solvable problem. But if you're interested in efficiency and scale and democratizing the opportunity to get multi rater feedback.
00:34:41:08 Tim: And quality analysis.
00:34:42:29 Junior: Then you must have I. Yeah depending on the size of your organization
I'm using must on purpose. If yes then what do we have an accurate, efficient and effective emotional intelligence approach? If we don't we would say let's go back.
00:34:59:26 Tim: Try again.
00:35:00:12 Junior: And try again. Let's work on it until we can get yes to all of those questions which is precisely what we have done with the IQ index. Some of you may be familiar with the historical versions of EQ index. We have revamped the whole thing, not the whole thing. We've kept the best parts, the framework. We've adapted the technological interface significantly to incorporate AI and multi rater that is led by the respondent.
00:35:28:18 Junior: It does not require a whole bunch of logistical complexity and administration from land. It's something that the target can target.
Sounds like the worst word the participant can, but that's the technical word. The participant can do themselves. They can enlist the feedback of their supervisors, their peers, their direct reports. All of this inside EQ, index. We've been working on EQ index for ten years, ten years.
00:36:02:25 Junior: And I just want to take a moment and thank the team because I feel so proud to be able to say, hey, we've arrived at this place after all this work.
00:36:11:00 - 00:36:11:15
Tim Yeah.
00:36:11:17 Junior: We have worked so hard to crack this problem, so hard from the technology, bringing the technology in-house years and years ago, which proved to be a very strategic decision and strategically important decision for us. Without that, there's no way we could outsource this in development with the speed that we need and the security that we need. So it's in-house.
00:36:35:10 Junior: So to our technology team, thank you to our production team. Thank you to everyone at Leader Factor. Thank you for helping us create this because it's very compelling. This can be deployed live. It can be deployed on demand that live can be live, virtual, onsite, instructor led. Every participant who uses EQ index has access to all of these
tools in an ongoing fashion, not least so we can measure longitudinally.
00:37:03:04 Tim: So junior, it becomes a process.
00:37:05:27 Junior: It's also something that almost never happens that we have longitudinal emotional intelligence data, especially multi rater. And it's tragic because you go through all of this investment to get that data. And there's never a retest. And if there is a retest it's a pulse. Or if there is a retest, it's the same amount of expense as it was to begin with.
00:37:26:09 Tim: Or it's the same self-assessment that's skewed.
00:37:29:08 - 00:37:29:18
Junior Right?
00:37:29:25 Tim: Right. So if you do a pre-post test experimental design and you come back for a, for a second test and, and you do you incorporate multi rater, you have the opportunity to have accurate data to see if there has been improvement over time. That's right. And that is really the holy grail in Landy. Yeah. And as we go further into this decade, we firmly believe that you're going to have to bring data, and it has to be based on a psychometric scale that is, valid.
00:38:07:11 Tim: And and so we finally have gotten to this point.
00:38:10:10 Junior: Yeah. And we're at the point in the conversation now where you're very much expecting me to sell you something, and I'm not going to, what we're going to do today is give away the new version of EQ to everyone. Everyone who's in attendance today gets the course for free, the whole thing unabridged. You'll get our 150 item assessment.
00:38:33:01 Junior: You'll get multi rater functionality so you can get feedback from others. You'll get AI integrated to debrief your results. You'll get video resources from Tim and myself that will teach you more about emotional intelligence, walk you through the nuances of everything we talked today. We only spent an hour with you and there's much more to be learned. All of this for free.
00:38:56:05 Junior: A few reasons for that one. We appreciate the work you do in the world, and we want people to be able to take advantage of this. Our aspiration is that you'll like this so much that you'll look to partner with Leader Factor and bring this to your organization. That's that's what we do. Yeah. We work with enterprises to improve leaders in emotional intelligence, but not just emotional intelligence, in
change management, in psychological safety coaching and accountability, all with courses just like this one.
00:39:30:19 Junior: And for those of you who are leader factor partners already, who use our services, our software, who license our technology and our content, all of this will be coming to you. If you're a current customer who licenses the total access Pass, you'll get access to all of this for free, no additional cost. Another thing that we have done is we've incorporated multi rater feedback into every one of our assessments, and they're almost all published so far.
00:40:02:10 Junior: So the top version of those courses, the Total Access Pass version gives you unlimited access to multi rater feedback for all of those skill areas. That's a pretty cool thing to be able to say, especially for me looking at that saying what a journey we've been on and what a cool thing to have access to, have built this technology in a way that democratizes the opportunity.
00:40:25:19 Junior: Historically, leadership development has lived at the upper echelons.
At least that's when it's been where it's been concentrated. What we're saying is now we can drive price down so far that we can get access to the whole organization and provide opportunities that were close to impossible.
00:40:42:18 Tim: They really were impossible, junior. We didn't have the technology. We didn't have the AI, we didn't have the scalability. We didn't have the multi rater functionality that does not require any administrate and administration. So all of those things were not possible in the past, but they are now. So this is the most exciting time and really in the history of the world that I've seen.
00:41:06:05 Junior: So for everybody who's live with us, it should be in your inbox. You probably will have an email already from Leader Factor with an invitation to this course, we would ask that you use it, that you really use it. Take full advantage. Use the multi rater, use the AI, go through the whole thing because what's the goal? At the end of the day, our institutional mission is to influence the world for good at scale.
00:41:33:07 Junior: That's what we're about. We want to scale the influence that we can have through good content and technology. If you like the course, we want you to reach out to us to ask, how can we partner? How can we roll this out more broadly to our organization to better effect leaders? If that's something that's interesting to you, please reach out to our team.
00:41:55:03 Junior: We would be more than happy to help you. Asynchronous certification is also something that Leader Factor is known for. You can become certified in EC and deploy that to your organization without flying somewhere for a three day hiatus. Right? You can do it immediately, and it's inexpensive. So if you want to become certified to deliver leader factor content in your organization, don't hesitate to reach out.
00:42:22:18 Junior: We have an entire team who's ready, willing, and able to help with that. We will go ahead and jump right into our Q&A.
00:42:30:21 Tim: Oh, Q&A. Let's do it.
00:42:31:25 Junior: We've got Q&A.
00:42:32:23 - 00:42:33:18
Tim Yeah.
00:42:33:21 Junior: Question number one. A lot of leaders get nervous about opening themselves up to multi rater feedback. What's the best way to ease that fear and help them see the value.
00:42:44:21 Tim: Such. Let's just start with a really easy question. Yeah.
00:42:49:07 - 00:42:49:17
Junior What do you.
00:42:49:17 Tim: Think to ease that fear, to ease that fear?
00:42:55:25 - 00:42:58:21 Tim
00:42:58:23 Tim: I don't think you can just erase that fear, JR, because there often is a discrepancy between your own data set and your third party raters. Okay, I think you have to prepare. This is what I used to do. I would prepare the leader in advance for the, the the reality and and the probability, the high probability that there was going to be a discrepancy in the data, there were going to be some differences and that you need to prepare for that.
00:43:30:24 Tim: Right. So that and see that as a gift and an opportunity so that you can establish an accurate baseline on where you are. As I said, if it's a self-report instrument, there's no psychological adjustment, hardly ever. But when you bring in multi rater, there is and there could be some angst, there could be some anxiety, there could be some discomfort.
00:43:57:07 Tim: That's okay. And then I think you need to sit in that data. You need to marinate in that data. You need to absorb that data. Take some time because there's an emotional adjustment to it. That's part of the journey.
00:44:10:22 Junior: It's part of the journey. I find that a really useful question to ask is to ask the participant, what do you want? What do you after? Are you interested in becoming better? It's impossible to say yes to that question and neglect multi rater.
00:44:24:16 Tim: That's so true right. Yeah.
00:44:26:17 Junior: And is the process of becoming better comfortable now if I told the person hey you're in charge of developing the the best leader in this organization, you're in charge. What kind of experiences and feedback would you give them in order to achieve that? Right. They would probably say something like, well, probably give them some stretch assignments. Sure.
00:44:50:18 Junior: I would probably give them some feedback from other people.
00:44:54:10 Tim: Okay. Okay. Perfect. That's what you.
00:44:56:02 Junior: Want, right? If that's what it takes to.
00:44:57:25 Tim: Journey, if.
00:44:58:15 Junior: That's what it takes to achieve the level of competence that we're after. Yeah. Then that's something that we're going to do.
00:45:03:29 Tim: What's the alternative junior. The alternative is willful blindness.
Yeah. Which has unintended consequences that compound over time. So you can want that or you can want to get better.
00:45:17:14 Junior: With so many surveys and feedback requests already hitting employees, how do you make sure multi rater feedback doesn't just feel like one more task on their plate? It's a great question. And this can be for the target or the rater on the target side. You have to help them understand the personal and professional and business impact. Those are the three angles that we're taking.
00:45:38:03 Junior: We're saying, here's what lies on the other side of development for you personally in your life. Generally speaking, outside of work too professionally, if you don't become competent in these areas, what is that risk? If we say, okay, we play Stacy's out over ten years, what happens? You're completely irrelevant, especially today. Three business impact. And those two things are tightly correlated to your professional impact and the business impact.
00:46:05:13 Junior: If you can generate business impact for the organization, it will reciprocate professional opportunity. So those are the three angles that I would say are important to get the stakes right. And then two on the radar side, we've tried to make that incredibly easy. And so all it is link, you click in and you have 30 items. It's not the 150 item assessment that you do for yourself.
00:46:28:15 Tim: As a rater as.
00:46:29:21 Junior: As a rater. You were just going to rate the target using 30 items, which are the 30 skills based on the the six domains, five items each.
You fly through those and average response time is less than ten minutes. So it's not that bad and especially if you frame it in the right way.
00:46:45:28 - 00:46:47:09
Tim I agree.
00:46:47:11 Junior: It seems as if AI is only as good as the information that teaches it.
What information do you use to train your AI? That's so good!
Thankfully, we've been doing this since how long? 1865. We've been doing this for a while. Tim's not that old, but we have a huge library of content. We have the largest normative database for psychological safety in the world.
00:47:09:17 Junior: We have one of the largest multi. It could be the largest multi rater databases of emotional intelligence that exists in one out.
00:47:16:03 Tim: Yeah. One of.
00:47:16:16 Junior: Those. All of that data goes in and shows benchmarks averages all of these things that other institutions don't have access to on the data side, which is why it's been important to us to keep control end to end of the entire process, all of the back end and all of the front end owned, operated by leader factor, I mean, obviously server side stuff, we don't own that.
00:47:40:00 Junior: But it's very interesting because if you don't have the data, there's only so much you can do. It's just like going into a ChatGPT or a perplexity or a grok and saying, help me with leadership development, right? If you don't have the data and you don't have the scalable models, then it's going to be very difficult. So it's based on all of leader factors IP over many years.
00:48:01:09 Junior: It's based on all of our assessment data. And what's really cool about that is it's almost model agnostic. And so we don't have to pick a
winner in the AI race. We can swap out models, which is another reason that all the technology is in-house and so becomes really cool on the data side. For HR and leaders rolling out IQ index across a big enterprise, what's your advice for keeping things consistent and making sure the momentum sticks?
00:48:27:06 Junior: Last few weeks you've been with some big executive teams in some big organizations. How would you feel about question if one of them asked you.
00:48:35:23 Tim: If you can possibly start at the top, start at the top. If there's commitment in the C-suite, that is where you want us to start, because they set the tone right, tone at the top. They model the way they create momentum. You're able to to take advantage of the power of early wins, and then you start rolling it out from there.
00:49:01:13 Tim: If that's not possible, then find a business unit. Find a functional area where there is commitment at the top. Because as you go down, you'll see the momentum, you'll see the impact, you'll see the ROI.
And then that will spread. That's what we've seen. But if at all possible, go in the front door. Executive team, go from there and, and then, work down through a cascade.
00:49:31:03 Tim: If you possibly can. That is the best. That's textbook. Yeah. If you possibly can. It's incredible the impact that you can gain. If you can take that approach, the other approaches can work. They're going to take a little longer, because you're trying to assemble a coalition. You're trying to create a beachhead somewhere and then go from there.
00:49:55:07 Junior: Here's another one. We got time for 1 or 2 more. What would be the risk and how can we avoid it? From misguided advice from AI? What I mean is, I as a human, I am full of biases. And that's what I would be feeding the AI to get an output. The AI is taking not just your input, but it's taking the data from yourself, respondent items and from the multi rater, as well as the framework with which we've imbued it and giving you feedback.
00:50:19:22 Junior: Right. So it's a niche use case of the AI where we've ratcheted down the aperture to focus exclusively on leadership development. And so it's not it's going to reject a lot of the queries that are outside the bounds. All of this is relatively new for us and the industry.
00:50:38:01 Tim: We're at the.
00:50:39:16 Junior: Forefront of what's going on in this area. And so there's there are improvements that will need to be made over time. And that's one of the things that we would enlist your help for on the user front is if you're engaging with the AI, if you're engaging with the platform and you're like, hey, the assessment would be cool if it did this thing or this feature would be interesting.
00:50:59:13 Junior: We are gathering that feedback constantly from all of our current customers and those who try out products like this. So very interested to see what everyone has to say. But we've ratcheted down the scope, to focus very exclusively on leadership development, and it's very formulaic in the way that it's going to approach the debrief and junior.
00:51:16:22 Tim: I think we also need to say that it's very important that we have operationalized definitions for the domains of of emotional intelligence and the skills that fall under each one. Yeah. So with those operationalized definitions, we're able to wring out a lot of the bias and prejudice that might be inherent.
00:51:37:27 Junior: And part of what's important to point out is the AI always points at the end to action and behavior. And that's part of the what's important about having a long tail to training is the action planning, the journaling and reflection and all of that. The lives inside the application. So once again, should be in your inbox. Go check it out.
00:51:59:09 Junior: We would love your feedback and if you like it, you go so far as to say if you love it, please reach out to Leader Factor. We would love to bring this to your organization through the Total Access Pass or in isolation. If you're interested in the skill or the other skill areas, or you're interested in certification, please reach out.
00:52:18:02 Junior: We would be happy to help. If you're not a subscriber to the podcast, go and do that to the leader factor. Tim and I, publishing episodes pretty frequently, and I want to end with a big thank you to the leader factor team for making all of this possible to our production crew, to the CHS team, all of the team members who have been in the chat, you've probably engaged with them.
00:52:38:19 Junior: I haven't been able to pay attention as much in the chat, but I'm sure they're lively. And thank you for all the work you do in the world. It's it's not acknowledged as often and as heartily as it should be.
So thank you for everything that you do to help leaders around the world. And we're here to help as well.
00:52:56:10 Junior: Tim, final thoughts?
00:52:57:29 Tim: Leadership development is becoming data driven, and you're going to see that more and more and more. And so we hope that you've enjoyed learning more about where emotional intelligence is going. Yep.
00:53:10:02 Junior: Thank you everybody. Enjoy your weekend. We'll see you next time. Bye bye.